Making sense of the mess that’s the UK’s EU referendum

Posted on by Simon in Blog, The Large Imagination Collider

EU_referendum

The time is fast approaching of the UK’s referendum on EU membership. The 23rd of June 2016 marks the day when finally, after numerous successive prime ministers have failed to deliver their promises that they let us have our say on whether or not we stay in the EU.

So – what do I think?

The truth is, I honestly don’t know. I have no idea what so ever! The scary thing is that the politicians can’t agree on the right thing to do either. With threats of what will happen if we stay or leave, the usual brand of scare mongering it’s hard to know what to think, let alone where to put my cross.

So forgive me for going all political and boring for a bit. I know I can hear the moans now – but bear with me. This need to be unleashed I think.

The Politics

The politics of this are it seems to me to be mainly economic. Trade agreements, EU grants, the freedom to travel between countries and jobs from the EU all contributing to money coming into the UK from business, imports and exports.

The in campaign say that this could all go – but in reality would it? There will have to be trade agreements, probably negotiated with the freedom to roam.

 The People

What I’ve heard from people is so boring and stupid it’s not funny. Some people seem to think that leaving the EU will bring a stop to working migrants into the country. This has been brought about by idiots like UKIP’s Nigel Farage. So, let’s get this clear – it we leave the EU, the migrants workers will not stop coming in! Simple as and in many cases they are taking up the work that no-one here in the UK want’s to do.  If we leave the Eu we will not see 100,00 Spanish resident suddenly having to leave. So get that thought out of your heads right now!

Much of this kind of migrant limitation policy has come from UKIP. The leader of UKIP is Nigel Farage and  heis a bigoted, racist liar and really anyone listening to him should know better. You’re arguably more likely to lose your jobs if we exit from the EU than if we remain – why? Because we could stand to lose business if we leave!

Business

The message from businesses at first was very damning of leaving the Eu, but in recent weeks this seems to have flipped to the other side. With anything like this I’m very wary, becasue at the end of the day the press is in control of the information they put in fron of us and it’s often distorted.

I have heard that some businesses are waiting until after the referendum before committing work to British companies. For a long term project I can kind of see the point of this, but short term I can’t see what difference it makes.

The Rest of Europe

Looking at some of the headlines the other day apparently 50% of Europeans also want an Eu referendum now. How true this is I don’t know – but if it is this would reinforce the reports that Italy, Spain and Portugal among other countries want to leave the EU.

It’s also been stated that leaving the EU could lead to war, I really hope that this isn’t the case. I would hope that in this day and age we have learned the lessons of previous generations and that this wouldn’t happen.

 

So what’s the point here? There are no facts on which anyone can base a rational an informed choice on what to do. One thing I’m fairly confident of is that the EU in it’s current form is fatally flawed and is likely not to last. It’s not the United States, it’s Europe.

So suppose the EU is doomed, do we let it fall apart by itself in a way that could casue unrest and (God forbid) war? Or is it best to start a controlled dismantling operation with the UK possibly leading the way? All I know is that no-one knows what the best thing is and what will happen. I also know that whoever you are and whatever you vote, for whatever reason – if people think things will change, they probably wont! Not in the way they would like anyway.

By the way, if any of you out there came to a conclusion becasue of reading this – let me know, becasue I still don’t know!

Simon 🙂

 

Published by Simon

My name is Simon and I create stories and art and pictures. Things just come to me, ideas and expressions and that what my blogs are about. My spaces to express and reach out to the world.

37 thoughts on “Making sense of the mess that’s the UK’s EU referendum”

  1. Pingback: Planet Simon – Weekly Roundup | Planet Simon

  2. Good and brave post Simon.
    The current fashionable thinking is that everyone should have an opinion by now. Of course everyone who has opinion is considered stupid and blinkered by those who have the opposite opinion. Just check out FaceBook .
    Unlike our internal elections it’s difficult to do the traditional British thing and not vote for a party, but vote against it by choosing someone else. This is a larger and more complex matter involving not just our own but other nations.
    (Pause….note to oneself…nobody wants to read your obtuse quasi-Marxist tirades-even your dear wife does not understand them keep them to yourself)
    My own support for the EU was/is based on the notion that tying up countries in a complex and over-arching bureaucracy is a great way to avoid wars. As I am a military history buff this works for me. However my own counter-argument is that history shows tensions do build up AND since Russia is in one of its resurgent stages this could bode ill if not handled carefully,
    In Europe during the Cold War era we were in a bit of a bubble, no one dared start a war here- H bombs and all, but things have changed. Regional wars in the Middle East, to repeat Russia in one of her historical flexing of power. It would seem now is not a good time to be dismantling the EU. There again, these very external tensions are causing stresses within.
    See; the word ‘Complex’ keeps turning up.
    I will be voting ‘Yes’ for the above concerns and not because of the big pamphlet the Govt sent us, but that will not be the end of it by a long stretch, History teaches us that.
    To be honest my vote will be a sort of ‘Buying Time’ one.
    Don’t know if that makes sense.
    Good post though.
    At least on WordPress we can have a civilised debate and not go screeching off as on Facebook/Amazon/Yahoo Comments etc,etc,etc.
    I do like it hereabouts.

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    1. I like the mentaility of popel here too, comments donrace off into screeching hate. I had never considered that point of view on it all and Russia’s influence. But I agree, like you say, whatever the outcome is just biding time.

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  3. “Simple as and in many cases they are taking up the work that no-one here in the UK want’s to do.” – I disagree. Maybe years ago, but I know people who are so desperate for work, they are willing to work as a cashier in Tesco – even with a degree. Jobs are so scarce, that many of the British do not care what they do, as long as they can feed their families. We cannot possibly keep going with the notion that jobs are in abundance here, because they are not. Also, I personally have seen, that many who cannot even speak English, are in high positions telling the British they cannot get help for this or that. There is something seriously wrong with this picture.
    Housing needs to be considered too. I buy a homeless English gentleman breakfast every time I see him. Yet, I am seeing immigrants/migrants/refugees, getting social housing, looking nice and healthy, and the British are being cast aside to made room for them. And they wonder why tensions are high. Along the road where my mother lives, there are at least four over-crowded households, with children of age to move out (30’s to 40’s), but they have to stay with their parents, as they have no chance in hell of somewhere affordable to live. Don’t get me wrong, I am all for helping others, but charity begins at ‘home’. Only then, can well look to help others. And at ‘home’, ours are suffering. So it is true, that leaving the EU will not atop migration, but something has to give.
    I think we have been sold short joining the EU. However, I think we should stay in – if we get our powers back, that the sly, back-stabber Gordon Brown signed over – despite the majority voting to stay with Western Europe only. Now, foreign murders, rapists and the like, are free to roam our streets, because we cannot deport them. If we try, they go to the European High Court, who more often than not, overturn what is ruled in England/ the UK. As if we don’t have our own criminals to deal with…
    How dangerous would things really get, if one person managed to ‘get hold’ of Europe and rule? I do not like that thought at all. I read last week, that the Germans ‘secretly’ want one European Army. What the hell for?
    I am more for leaving the EU, however, I am aware of the implications, so I am still undecided. We managed to trade and work as a country before. As the saying goes, if it isn’t broke…
    As for a war if we leave the so called Union – if someone wants a war, then it is a war we are going to have. There is always going to be a warmonger out there, regardless of what the British decide to do.

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    1. I agrees the situation is far from perfect, the main problem being that there are area of hig population / low employment or both and others where there is a need for workers.
      The issue is that the problem is so big that it’s difficult to get the big picture on what’s really going on and solve all the issues, being in or out of the EU will not solve them either.
      The un-democratic nature of the EU is the biggest thing that scares me and I was thinking about this driving home, your exact point of “what would happen if some nutter got hold of it?”
      I dunno… I just dont.

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      1. Unfortunately, the only thing we can do is to wait and see what happens. I don’t know how the British are going to deal with this; we have been placed in such a predicament, the next move (Brexit) is one of the most important moves we will probably see in our lifetime. We spend an awful lot of money on being in the EU. I read somewhere that it was £350 million a week. How many schools and hospitals could we run with this money at a fraction of the cost? Then I read that out of every £7 sent to foreign aid, Britain sends £1. Add that up, then think why we are supporting them so much in AND out of the country, whilst we have British pensioners who can’t afford to eat, freezing to death in winter. What is with that?
        I do not know what the best thing to do is, but I miss hearing the English language in public. Even when I call the dentist, or anywhere for that matter, I find myself saying to the person at the other end “I cannot understand what you are saying”, because their accent is so heavy.
        I watched “Can’t Pay? We’ll Take It Away” a couple of weeks ago. A British retired couple was living in a private rented accommodation, as they could not get a council property. Caps were introduced (as people on benefits were taking the p*ss). They could not longer afford to keep up with the excess rent they had to pay after their savings ran out. They had one hour to pack up their things and too vacate the property, after the High Court Writ Enforcers turned up. They were homeless and out on the streets, like they were discarded rubbish. The woman asked her husband “What about our photos?” as she was crying. He told her they will arrange with the Landlord to come back for them later. I cried my heart out. Should these not be the people we look after first? Should these not be the people who get social/council housing?
        I think, the best thing for me to do, is to draw my comments to a close. I am so angry at what is going on. My beloved country pretty much in ruins (or close to).
        On that note, have a great day Simon. xo

        Liked by 1 person

      2. Have a great day too – I get what you’re saying here and it’s sad that those who deserve seem to suffer so much when society should be there to help them. To be honest the way the system is set up seems to encourage cheats and I don’t know how they always seem to get away with it.

        Liked by 1 person

      1. Is that the British version of asking how I am? I am good. Still trying to psych myself up for my article and send in a sample. Thanks for the words of encouragement.

        Liked by 1 person

  6. I don’t see any point with EU, really. I don’t live in the UK but in Northern Europe. EU hasn’t really made anything better for us, as far as I can see. We joined EU originally cause of scare mongering/propaganda. Our neighbor Norway did not join, but still survived and apparently doesn’t seem to have any problems trading with other countries etc… Nah, I wish my country would leave EU. It seems all we do is pay millions and even billions yearly to EU and getting a fraction of that back. And oh they also like to micromanage us and forbid sales of our traditional sort of chewing tobacco we have had for a couple of hundred years. Sorry for the rant lol. 😊/the “rebel”

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  7. Wow! Being in the US, of course, I’m not a part of this but will be interested in how it plays out

    You’ve got racist politicians mouthing off though? Haha, don’t feel bad… we’ve got Trump over here scaring the crap out of us 🙂

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      1. Holy crap, I have no idea… At first it felt like a joke, but now he’s actually the Republican candidate.

        My theory is that Americans are frustrated by the idea that political candidates are all for sale, part of the system, so Bernie Sanders and Trump got popular by seeming outside the mainstream.

        Many Republicans are horrified though, to their credit.

        He has a passionate base, though. They think of him as a solid businessman who will “tell it like it is” and get us out of economic recession, or “make America great again,” whatever that means.

        I suspect he’s a backlash to our politically correct atmosphere. He’s saying what some Americans secretly believe, but are too afraid to mention.

        The only benefit if he’s elected, in my opinion, is that comedy political shows will have lots of hilarious fodder for years to come.

        Liked by 2 people

      2. I myself am frustrated at Americas politically correct system. That’s one of the few things I like about trump. He’s a lunatic, but I do enjoy his candidness.

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      10. I couldn’t trust her as far as I could throw her chunky ass. And how she goes around campaigning to the minority’s class like she knows what they are going through. It’s insulting. She’s a joke, an evil joke.

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      14. I have mixed feelings about it. On the one hand, it’s good that people are more sensitive to each other, but on the other hand, it’s getting harder to have any real discussions without everything turning into who is the most offended.

        Trump scares me, but I can see how people could decide “at least we know what he’s thinking” when it feels like so many other politicians are scripted. We worry what people are secretly thinking since no one is allowed to say it anymore.

        Liked by 2 people

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